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REVEALED: Justin Jones' clashes with fellow lawmakers expose bitter divisions on Tennessee's Capitol Hill

NewsChannel 5 cameras capture explosive exchange between Rep. Justin Jones and Republican Leader William Lamberth
Posted: 6:17 PM, Apr 24, 2024
Updated: 2024-04-27 10:24:19-04
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NASHVILLE, Tenn. (WTVF) — He may be the most polarizing person on Tennessee's Capitol Hill — people either love him or hate him.

Nashville Rep. Justin Jones has become a symbol of the toxic environment in the Tennessee General Assembly where parties on both sides of the aisle are now completely fed up with the other, not even attempting to disguise their disgust in public exchanges.

Jones portrays himself as a valiant social justice warrior battling a racist and unjust system.

Behind the scenes, some of the Nashville Democrat's harshest critics are members of his own caucus. In public, they may express mild disagreement with his incendiary approach. In private, they accuse him of sowing division even among people who agree with him on core issues. Many Democrats are barely on speaking terms with Jones.

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Rep. Justin Jones

The first-term lawmaker's combative approach was on full display on the House floor Tuesday as protesters in the galleries expressed their outrage over the passage of a bill that would allow teachers with handgun permits to carry guns in schools.

As lawmakers attempted to continue with business, Jones paraded around the House floor recording video — even after he was repeatedly ruled out of order.

It was reminiscent of the anti-gun protest that Jones waged last year on the House floor — part of the so-called Tennessee Three — that resulted in him and Rep. Justin Pearson, D-Memphis, being expelled from the House. Both were quickly returned to their seats by the local governments.

But the most revealing incident may be a shouting match that occurred last week on the House floor between Jones and Republican Leader William Lamberth from Portland.

Lamberth's version: "All year long, Rep. Jones has been verbally berating staff."

Jones' version: "This has been a session marked by vitriol and bullying from a majority of White men who run this Capitol."

The Nashville Democrat approached the House speaker's podium, upset that he had not been called upon during debate over the state budget.

Everyone agrees that Jones called someone a name.

NewsChannel 5 had a camera on the floor that captured the moment.

"Well, how could your do-boy get it?" Jones asked Speaker Cameron Sexton, pointing to his left.

Lamberth interjected, "That's not cool."

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Rep. Justin Jones argues his case with House Speaker Cameron Sexton

"Do-boy" is a derogatory term for someone submissive.

Multiple sources say Jones was referring to a veteran House attorney who was standing there, and the video shows Jones pointing at the attorney.

"There is no time that a state representative should look at a multi-decade state employee and call him a 'do-boy,'" Lamberth told NewsChannel 5 Investigates.

Jones' version? He was actually talking about his Republican colleague.

"My comments were directed to William Lamberth. He knows that."

NewsChannel 5 Investigates asked Jones, "Was it appropriate for you to call him a 'do-boy?'"

"Was it appropriate? It was honest," the lawmaker replied.

As the conversation continues with Sexton and the House clerk, Jones can be heard repeatedly telling Lamberth, "Get out of my face. Get out of my face. Get out of my face. Get out of my face."

House Democratic Leader Karen Camper of Memphis pounds on the table to get Jones' attention.

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Rep. Justin Jones (center) confronts Republican Leader William Lamberth

NewsChannel 5 Investigates asked Lamberth, "Did you say anything that could be implied as being racist at all?"

"Absolutely not," the Portland Republican insisted.

Multiple witnesses say Lamberth appeared to have been provoked when Jones continued pointing his finger in his face.

"And he said, I will knock you out. That's what he told me," Jones claimed.

On video from the incident, he can be heard repeatedly telling Lamberth, "Try it, try it."

Even Republicans agree Lamberth said something along those lines.

A few seconds later, Jones can be heard telling the Republican leader, "Lamberth, go to hell."

And the exchange continues, neither seemingly willing to let it go and get back to business.

"What did you mean by racist incidents?" Lamberth asks.

Jones quickly replies, "You are a racist, you are a racist."

Yet, even my questions about that incident, Jones charged, reflected my own racial biases.

"Instead of calling out the acts of racism, it is more offensive to you that I call someone a racist for acting in a racist manner than for them acting racist — and that is wrong."

Still, it was such a shocking scene that I wanted to get another opinion, turning to Rep. Sam McKenzie, D-Knoxville, the chair of the legislature's Black Caucus.

I asked, "Do you think that Leader Lamberth is a racist?"

"No, I don't think that Leader Lamberth is a racist," McKenzie said.

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Rep. Sam McKenzie

"Was it appropriate for Representative Jones to call him a racist?"

"I have rarely — no, I have never called anyone a racist. I don't do that. It takes the air out of the room."

In the outburst on the House floor, McKenzie sees two stubborn men unwilling to look at the world through each other's eyes.

"Their two personalities are really eerily similar — even though they are on opposite sides on most issues that are contentious. But I think that personality likeness is what drove that," he added.

We asked, "Hot-headed?"

"Hot-headed, strong-willed, feel that their issue is right 100% of the time."

He does blame the Republican supermajority for creating much of the tension by limiting the number of opposing voices on committees and cutting off debate on important topics, leaving some members feeling like they have to yell to be heard.

As for the scene, shouting at a Republican colleague on the House floor and calling him a racist, that is not a unique occurrence for Jones.

He has insulted a GOP lawmaker who immigrated to America from India, telling him: "You put a brown face on white supremacy."

He's compared his fellow Republicans to the Klan, calling them "the white sheets caucus."

He suggested they are not much better than neo-Nazis who've marched through Nashville's streets.

"Some may argue that this is a neo-Nazi rally happening every time we convene in this body."

NewsChannel 5 Investigates asked McKenzie, "Is that good trouble or is that just trouble?"

"To me, it's just trouble," the Black Caucus chair said.

McKenzie said that throwing out the "r-word" so frequently does nothing to change hearts and minds.

"It's become a word. It's kind of like 'woke,' and it's become a word that's really, really divisive."

"A weapon?"

"It's a weapon — and a weapon on both sides. If someone called a racist, the fall out, like, oh, no, this is the worst thing ever."

Jones portrays himself as the victim of a pervasively racist system, although there's little evidence for some of his more provocative claims.

"I've been called a boy, I've been told that I'm worthless, I've been told that I don't belong here."

His most bitter clashes have come with Government Operations Chairman John Ragan.

In one meeting, the Oak Ridge Republican tried to cut Jones off after ruling that the Nashville lawmaker was veering off the topic of the bill being discussed.

"I did not yield my time," Jones defiantly told the committee chairman.

Ragan responded, "Sir, you don't get to yield your time. If you want me to rule you out of order, I will. It will have consequences."

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Rep. John Ragan

Jones shot back, "Sir, you have a gavel, you don't have a whip."

We went to see Ragan about the relationship between him and Jones.

"Rep. Jones' accusations have no basis whatsoever, and yet he insists on hurling them from the floor whether on the microphone or not," Ragan told NewsChannel 5 Investigates.

Like the clash between Jones and Lamberth, Ragan makes it clear he has little use for the Nashville Democrat — although he couches it in terms of "what some people say."

"Unfortunately, it appears that Rep. Jones is more concerned with soundbites for television and using whatever disruption and turmoil he can create to raise money. I certainly wouldn't call him this, but some have said that is the activities of a grifter," Ragan said.

We noted, "But you are sort of calling him that."

"No, I'm not. I said, some have said that, not me."

NewsChannel 5 Investigates asked McKenzie, "Do you think Chairman Ragan is a racist?"

The Black Caucus chair paused.

"Chairman Ragan, his answers are very condescending when you are talking about things of race. They are extremely condescending."

He added, "Whether he's a racist or not, I don't know. He has some horrible pieces of legislation that does take our race back decades and decades."

Among Ragan's legislation: bills prohibiting the teaching of so-called divisive concepts in schools and colleges.

Jones has insinuated that Ragan's proposals stem from his racist upbringing.

"The sponsor grew up in North Carolina in a segregated school, and how do we teach that? How do we talk about that if we cannot talk about divisive concepts?"

Referring to Jones' claim to have garnered that information from Ragan's Facebook page, the chairman shot back: "I will point out, sir, that you apparently have a problem with reading, because I did not go to a segregated school."

In fact, Ragan admits that his schools were only integrated when he was a junior in high school.

"The accusation that he meant to imply is that someone that makes me a racist," Ragan said. "It's very clear what the implication was that he was intending — and I decidedly dispute it."

We wanted to know, "Why not just concede the point, though, that much of your schooling was in a segregated environment?"

"Because it's irrelevant."

All of this leaves Tennesseans with lawmakers who know how to yell at each other, but with little ability to really listen.

Watch related stories:

REVEALED: Were Black people 'oppressed'? Debate highlights racial divide in Tennessee House
REVEALED: 'I've never seen things as bad': Veteran lawmaker mourns loss of civility in Tennessee House

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